WWII - We could have defeated Germany at any time during the War


#1

I just read something very interesting to a WWII buff.
The Allies could have defeated Nazi Germany at any time by using poison gas . German transport was defendant on horse drawn vehicles. Gas would have killed the horses, stopping the German army in it’s tracks.
Following is an interview with Herman Goering after his capture"

From “Of Spies and Stratagems,” by Stanley Lovell:

Q. We know you had Gas Blau [[a name used for nerve gas](which would have stopped the Normandy invasion. Why didn’t you use it?
A. Die Pferde (the horses).
Q. What have horses to do with it?
A. Everything. A horse lies down in the shafts or between the thills as soon as his breathing is restricted. We never have had a gas mask a horse would tolerate.
Q. What has that to do with Normandy?
A. We did not have enough gasoline to adequately supply the German Air Force and the Panzer Divisions, so we used horse transport in all operations. You must have known that the first thing we did in Poland, France, everywhere, was to seize the horses. All our material was horse-drawn. Had we used gas you would have retaliated and you would have instantly immobilized us.
Q. Was it that serious, Marshal?
A. I tell you, you would have won the war years ago if you had used gas – not on our soldiers, but on our transportation system. Your intelligence men are asses!

I didn’t post a link because the link contained the name of Germany’s leader, which stops the thread from being posted.


#2

Gas masks were developed and used for horses during WWI.

The rubber bladder above the feed bag is an example.

Here’s another where they adapted one for humans used on a mule.


#3

Horses had gas mask it was mandatory after the use of gas in WWI.


#4

You had shown that to me before. I was thinking of that when I was reading the article.
Goering said in his interview “We never have had a gas mask a horse would tolerate.”


#5

Goering didn’t know what he was talking about, he was Luftwaffe and at the time would have said anything to garner mercy.


#6

Here’s a few more examples.

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#7

Goering was more than Luftwaffe. He had a list of titles a mile long.
He was deputy Fuhrer (designated successor), Chairman of the Reich Defense Council and Reich Marshal of the Greater German Reich to name a few. He would have known what he was talking about.

I would think a claim that ‘Germany respected enemy troops and did not want to use gas’ or something similar would have garnered more mercy, than the horse story. I don’t see any mercy begging in the horse account.

Another factor. Germany had Sarin gas. The masks pictured would not have protected against that. H believed the Allies had it too (They didn’t). He had been fed false intelligence by Adm. Canaris.


#8

I’ve always been a little fascinated by the fact that Nazi Germany invented and developed organophosphate nerve agents - but never used them.


#9

Not only developed them but had a huge stockpile of them- both the raw gas and gas loaded munitions. Something like 30,000 tons.


#10

Churchill was ready and almost eager to respond in kind. As it was people talked him out of using non lethal gas and I have no doubt der Fuhrer was well aware of that.


#11

MacArthur was ready to use gas had the Japanese attacked Australia. He had tons of it ready.


#12

Yeah he was a bit of a nut. He wanted to nuke China during the Korean war. With a dozen bombs or more…

Perhaps MacArthur was another reason der fuhror just didn’t go there. His personal experience with mustard gas had to be a factor even if there is no record of him saying that


#13

They were terrified of the potential allied response.

The allies had stockpiled hundreds of thousands of tons of mustard and phosgene. Even though gas mask of the era could stop it it still would have caused extreme casualties on unprotected and surprised troops. Plus there wasn’t much the Germans could have done to stop the allies from using them on German cities.


#14

He was right. Nukes would have been the only way to defeat China and Reunify all of Korea.

Instead it’s remained divided with half the country under the thumb of some of the most despicable dictators in world history.

To this day a state of war remains between NK, SK, and The US.


#15

Troops in MOP gear are also less than half as efficient as they are when operating without it and troops have to be pulled off of the line about every 24 hours at most for decontamination, food, rest etc.


#16

That is something that often gets overlooked. It’s a lot of extra weight and even modern gear gets uncomfortable. My dad told me that was his least favorite part of training when he was in the service.


#17

I think it was the right choice. Not dropping a dozen nukes that is.


#18

The detonation of RDS-1 on August 29, 1949, ensured the United States could no longer freely use nuclear weapons.


#19

If we had, N. Korea would be free and China would not be the rising threat that they are today.

No telling though how the other dominoes would have fallen.


#20

I agree. We now know that the Truman administration had been seriously considering nuking the Chinese airfields for quite awhile before MacArthur asked for them. MacArthur’s request wasn’t outlandish, at all. Truman’s fear of war with Stalin was the reason he finally declined. Stalin was reluctantly supplying N Korea. We now know war would not have happened. Stalin was irritated by the Korean War, and Mao. He didn’t trust him and wanted the US to win. He didn’t want China strengthened in any way.