Should the President suspend habeas corpus and arrest those invading our borders?


#179

Spending $5 billion on a border wall will do almost nothing regarding stopping illegal immigration. It would be a waste of money. We can use that money in a smarter way.


#184

There’s literally zero point in trying to engage in a conversation with you. You cherry pick random quotes from the 1800s and label that as proof that your position is correct.

None of your Madison quotes have anything to do with suspending habeas corpus.

I will agree that neither party is interested in small government. At least the Dems are honest about it; the GOP uses it for campaign fodder, then abandons their small government, fiscal conservative “principles” when they get into power.

Where we disagree is the enumerated powers within the Constitution. Time and time again you have been demonstrably wrong as evidenced by numerous court decisions that run completely counter to your arguments.


#185

@johnwk2 John, have you shown your math yet? I’m beginning to think that “almost 50 percent” is perhaps just a weeeeee bit exaggerated.


#186

If 100 percent of Republicans get welfare. Then almost 50 percent of Americans must receive welfare. Is my math correct?


#187

Republicans are ~26% of the populations.


#188

:roll_eyes:

When your “math” includes individuals, get back to me. The old saying goes: “Figures lie and liars figure!”

JWK

Illegal immigration is now costing American citizens over $18 billion a year in healthcare costs alone, far more than the measly $5 billion asked for to build a wall! LINK


#189

Got it - we’ll just put the “almost 50 percent” into the “things John is pulling out of his ass” category.

Oh, and as for families vs. individuals, if you taken a few seconds to read even the first paragraph of the study, you would have come across this (emphasis mine):

While average family size was the same, average annual expenditures of families who have children and were receiving means-tested government assistance were about half the amount spent by families not receiving assistance.

In other words, percentage of families ~ percentage of individuals.


#192

I agree with this.


#195

Your study does not include the number of illegal entrants who use taxpayer financed emergency rooms;

Your study, does not include the number of people using one or more of the countless taxpayer financed state assistance programs . . . etc.

In other words, your “study” is meaningless in trying to determine the number of people receiving some form of taxpayer financed assistance.

:roll_eyes:

JWK

Illegal immigration is now costing American citizens over $18 billion a year in healthcare costs alone, far more than the measly $5 billion asked for to build a wall! LINK


#196

Why stop there, why not just declare martial law along the border, like you really want?


#197

In case you missed it, the OP is not about “the wall”. It is: "Should the President suspend habeas corpus and arrest those invading our borders?"

It appears you dislike my desire to refine the subject into specific discussions such as:

do walls work;

should the president hold firm on securing our border;

The president cannot shut down the federal government;

etc., etc., and,

etc

:roll_eyes:

JWK

American citizens are sick and tired of being made into tax-slaves to finance the economic needs of millions of poverty stricken, poorly educated, low and unskilled aliens who have invaded America’s borders.


#198

No I dislike the highly repetitive rhetorical questions that all revolve around the same subject matter.


#199

Well, then, do not join in on the discussion. It’s really a very simple solution. :roll_eyes:

JWK

The Democrat Party Leadership has been behind this ongoing invasion of our southern border since 1985 when amnesty was granted to 2.5 million illegal entrants in return for a guarantee to build a wall and secure our border. And here we are today, no wall, but 10-15 million more illegal entrants.


#200

No one is “invading” our borders. So no, there is no reason to suspend Habeus Corpus.


#201

I can do as I please, and for the record your reply to me wasn’t even a reply to you, so there is always that. :roll_eyes:


#202

The question of an invasion taking place has already been addressed elsewhere and the Citizens of Mexico have emphatically called it an invasion.

See: Tijuana protesters blast ‘invasion’ of Mexico by caravan of U.S.-bound migrants

On Sunday, displeased Tijuana residents waved Mexican flags, sang the Mexican national anthem and chanted "Out! Out!" in front of a statue of the Aztec ruler Cuauhtemoc, less than two kilometres from the U.S. border. They accused the migrants of being messy, ungrateful and a danger to Tijuana.

They also complained about how the caravan forced its way into Mexico, calling it an “invasion.” And they voiced worries that their taxes might be spent to care for the group.

Also see: Mexican Citizens: Trump is Right, This Caravan is an Invasion:

But you are entitled to your opinion even though the people suffering under it are calling it an invasion.

JWK

Illegal immigration is now costing American citizens over $18 billion a year in healthcare costs alone, far more than the measly $5 billion asked for to build a wall! LINK


#203

Fascinating. Lol

I don’t take the hyperbole from Mexicans any more seriously than I do from Americans. There is no invasion. No need to suspend Habeus Corpus.


#204

Perhaps you’ve forgotten, John but YOUR post said (emphasis mine) “we have almost 50 percent of American citizens receiving some form of welfare”.

Citizens, John, citizens . . . and I can’t help but notice that during this exchange you haven’t provided any backup for your assertion. Until such time, I’m just going to have to assume it’s nothing more than something you’ve conjured up from thin air. But don’t fret, that puts you right along with Trump in the veracity category.


#205

One should note when even considering the assinign premise of this op.

When in history has government ever given up what it has previously taken?

When in history has government not used a previously set president to further erode your rights because they got away with it before?

Think about that, today they suspend habeas corpus, tomorrow what do they take? And some of you are willing to take that chance?

Not this guy. I’ve already seen the most recent example I can think of, that being the Patriot Act… no thanks.


#206

see: We’ve Crossed The Tipping Point; Most Americans Now Receive Government Benefits

“Obamacare has pushed us over the entitlements tipping point. In 2011 some 49.2 percent of U.S. households received benefits from one or more government programs—about 151 million out of an estimated 306.8 million Americans—according to U.S. Census Bureau data released last October.”

JWK

There is no surer way to weaken, subdue, demoralize and then conquer a prosperous and freedom loving people than by allowing and encouraging the poverty stricken, poorly educated, low-skilled, criminal and diseased populations of other countries to invade that country, and make the country’s existing citizens tax-slaves to support the economic needs of such invaders.